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Offline chrisknight  
#1 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 1:13:51 AM(UTC)
chrisknight


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Acetone 56C 134F |
Methanol 64C 147F | ForeShots & Heads section
Ethyl Acetate 77.1C 172F |
---------------------------|

Ethanol 78C 173F - 177F ----------- Good Stuff

---------------------------
2-Propanol 82C 180F | Tails section
1-Propanol 97C 207F |
Water 100C 212F |
Butanol 116C 241F |
Amyl alcohol 137.8C 280F |
Furfural 161C 322F |

Hello,
I have searched and read, but can't seem to put it together.
I commonly hear that your runs should be cut up into 4 major sections: Foreshots|Heads|Hearts|Tails
I understand that the foreshots, heads, and tails need not make it into your drinking containers.
If the above is true, please help me fit these 4 major "cut" sections into what seems like 3 major temperature bands.

I keep reading that "you'll just know with experience and your nose". I'm sorry, please forgive me if I offend anyone, but
that is careless and dangerous when you're dealing with poison. You simply can not escape the science of this.
Confused.

Thanks,
Chris
Offline John Barleycorn  
#2 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 3:08:21 AM(UTC)
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"Chris,

This is a really good read that should answer many of your questions:

""A Novice Guide to Cuts"": http://homedistiller.org...pic.php?f=15&t=11640

--JB"
Offline chooch  
#3 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 5:14:52 AM(UTC)
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I would not call heads and tails "Poison" at all...may not taste the greatest but hardly poison. Simply throw out the first 100 ml..most will be the fore shots (with methanol) and a tad of the heads, collect 150 - 200 ml samples in a numbered sequence (cuts) and keep watching clarity, once it is obvious that it is cloudy, your done. Leave samples open to air out over night. Next day start in the middle of your samples and smell,taste and look at each one. What I do is use an eye dropper, spoon and some water. I put equal amounts of sample & water (about 4 of each) and taste it. You will notice a difference between the sample. It takes practice, reading, more practice and more learning ...but it is a hobby after all. Just my 2 cents- Enjoy and shine on!
Offline chrisknight  
#4 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 5:24:34 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: John Barleycorn Go to Quoted Post
Chris,

This is a really good read that should answer many of your questions:

"A Novice Guide to Cuts": http://homedistiller.org...pic.php?f=15&t=11640

--JB


Thank you. I don't know how I missed that. That is just what I was looking for, and mostly confirms my initial assumptions.
Offline chrisknight  
#5 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 5:45:58 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: chooch Go to Quoted Post
I would not call heads and tails "Poison" at all...may not taste the greatest but hardly poison. Simply throw out the first 100 ml..most will be the fore shots (with methanol) and a tad of the heads, collect 150 - 200 ml samples in a numbered sequence (cuts) and keep watching clarity, once it is obvious that it is cloudy, your done. Leave samples open to air out over night. Next day start in the middle of your samples and smell,taste and look at each one. What I do is use an eye dropper, spoon and some water. I put equal amounts of sample & water (about 4 of each) and taste it. You will notice a difference between the sample. It takes practice, reading, more practice and more learning ...but it is a hobby after all. Just my 2 cents- Enjoy and shine on!


Well, I have to agree with you in a general way. However, acetone, methanol, ethyl acetate, etc... in concentrate is something that I would try to avoid if I had the knowledge and equipment to do so. Would you drink acetone? Those nasties in a dilution (beer) may not be of concern. Being a man of science, I think it would be an objective to go for the hearts, and nothing else. Thank you for the input. I like your method of collecting small liner samples and starting in the middle, working outward to "nose it out". I just think that only the hearts, or samples close to it on either end will be worthy. Those that have no way to measure vapor temp, and weighing that into your cuts decision are risky people. LOL Thanks guys!
~paranoid.
Offline chooch  
#6 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 7:24:25 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: chrisknight Go to Quoted Post
..... acetone, methanol, ethyl acetate, etc... in concentrate is something that I would try to avoid if I had the knowledge and equipment to do so. Would you drink acetone?
~paranoid.


All that is in the fore shots..thats why you throw it away. You are correct - the hearts are what you want - but you want to get a bit of both heads and tails also for taste and ABV. Heads are what causes some mean headaches - cheap store bought has alot of heads and tails have alcohol in them but much less than hearts and contain some smooth flavors (but not deep into the tails-yuck) so its a balance that only you can learn through trial and error Cool Shine On!
Offline chrisknight  
#7 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 7:47:32 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: chooch Go to Quoted Post
All that is in the fore shots..thats why you throw it away. You are correct - the hearts are what you want - but you want to get a bit of both heads and tails also for taste and ABV. Heads are what causes some mean headaches - cheap store bought has alot of heads and tails have alcohol in them but much less than hearts and contain some smooth flavors (but not deep into the tails-yuck) so its a balance that only you can learn through trial and error Cool Shine On!


I think after spending a few hours on this site that I'm starting to catch on. You want to run into your tails a bit so that you can bring over some flavor of what ever you're mashing. Makes sense. ...and some heads are OK, but not too much, or you'll have headache in a jar. I do realize that your thermometer can't tell you everything. But, would you say that those that are "doing it by nose" are in the 173F-180F target range for primary collection into 100ml cuts? It seems to be right.
Offline chooch  
#8 Posted : Saturday, February 09, 2013 8:16:03 AM(UTC)
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I think the temp is dependent on your equipment...mine (cheap-o pot still) works at 188 - 195 so again experience is the best teacher. Just be safe and throw out the nasty's and watch for product to start to cloud up and you'll be fine. Some folks take larger cuts and some have done this long enough that they dont take any but yes those are the temps for ethos to vaporize
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