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I've heard this term tossed around a lot but there seems to be some discrepancies in what it actually means to different people. Just for the sake of clarification, what is YOUR definition of smooth and how do you obtain it?
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For the record, my definition of 'smooth' is an end product with very minimal burn and no harshness. When you take a straight shot and it doesn't make your eyes cross, your nose run, or send you off to find something to mix with it to make it drinkable. I consistently get 95% return off my reflux still, then after cutting it to 40% I run it through the Z carbon filter. It comes out smooth as silk. Pretty basic but it makes for good straight sippin' hooch.
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That's pretty much how I define it. However, I've heard a number of definitions. I wish I could get 95% like you do. My best was 93% but mostly it runs around 91%. I don't have a Z filter but I do filter through Brewhaus carbon in a five foot tube. I understand that the glucose that Rick sells is very good for smoothing a beverage without making it too sweet. I've not had any complaints and most people love it but I have heard the opposite. I've been told that my bourbon was too smooth and needed more bite. Never thought I'd hear someone complain about a whiskey being too smooth. I thought that was what you wanted. LOL
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I use Turbo-48 and let it sit in the fermentor for 8 days, use super-kleer to clarify, then distill at a very slow drip. That's the secret to getting 95%. The last time I distilled I ended up with 4 full quarts averaging 95% out of a 26L wash. I went to tails when it fell below 93% and got another half quart. I will toss that into the next batch. The z filter works okay but is a royal pain to fill. There has to be a better way. I also have had complaints about too smooth. Usually it comes from someone telling me that it 'just isn't strong enough'. Somehow they associate bite with strength. That is until they try to stand up! It's the same kind of people that think dark beers are stronger than lighter colored beers just because they are darker. They are just operating under wrong assumptions. They don't seem to mind drinking a lot of it though. I haven't messed with glucose so I can't comment on that. If anyone else out there has, what results did you get?
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I double distill my product and I have had some people complain that the final product is too smooth and needs a little bite. I say screw them and I make the hooch the way I want it to be and I am fond of a smooth product. I have used glycerine and it will give a slight sweetness to finished product, I can only submise that glucose is nothing but and sugar diluted and will definately give a sweetness to the product.
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That's strange that others have had the same complaint that it's 'too smooth'. There is something wrong there. LOL
I haven't double distilled my hooch but I do distill at a slow rate. Still, I only get about 3/5's of a gallon at 91% on a 26 liter batch. I've got to be doing something wrong but I just can't figure out what it is. As far as the glucose is concerned, in the final product I use 2 oz. to the fifth ,750 ml,. I don't personally detect any increase in sweetness until I put approximately 3 oz. in. Maybe I go to far but everyone ,except the too smooth group, say it's delicious. I'd just like to get my distilled proof up to where you are ,Elricko,. I use the same thing as you do with 15 lbs. of sugar. The only difference I can see is that I distill at 172 degrees at about 4-5 drips per second. Maybe that's where I'm going wrong. However, the end result is much less than yours in amount and purity.
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Hmmm. Well lets look at the packing. I use 1 3/4 Ltr rashing rings and use copper packing at the bottom of the column, at the break in the middle and again at the top. The Turbo-48 I use is the Mile-Hi brand. I let it sit for 8 days which gives me 20% from the wash, then clearify for three days. Other than that I don't know. My temp is about the same as yours and the drip is a little slower but not much ,2-4 drips per second,. I use a 1500 watt hot water heater coil as my heat source with a dimmer switch for constant ,and quiet, heat. Plus I always throw my tails in from the last batch. Any of this help?
As far as 'smooth'? I'm with c....freebrew, screw them. I'll drink Grey Goose over Smirnoff's anytime.
Does the glucose thicken the final product? My buddy made some apricot brandy and used it. It's the best brandy I've ever tasted. I'm not sure which essence he used. He swears by Top Shelf, but I think he used Prestige for that one. His Top Shelf bourbon is as good as any top quality bourbon I've ever tasted. Better than Crown Royal.
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I can atest to elrickos results. Absolutley wonderful stuff and as clear as sparkling water. I think the difference is in the heat. I use propane heat and I am in the phase of converting to the electric heating elements for a more uniform heat. Elericko keep up the great work. Your teacher.........
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I tried the 1500 watt elec. but it bit the dust after the second run. Went to propane and have been happy ever since. Never have any tails as the collection stops dripping when the 172 degree collection ends. I assume the big difference between our brews is that I don't let it sit for 8 days. More like four days for me and then one day with sparkeloid added.
As far as the glucose is concerned.... I tried the glycerine but there is a metallic aftertaste when used to any appreciable extent. One the other hand, glucose can be added to a 750ml spirit at the rate of 2 oz. without any appreciable seetness being added. At around 3 oz., there is a slightly sweeter taste to the spirit. I like a little thickness ,presence, to my spirits and I find that glucose works better than glycerine by a long shot. Plus, it's cheaper.
I've tried the Top Shelf but it really doesn't impress me very much. Prestige ,in my opinion, is much better and cost less per liter.
Give the glucose a try and see if you like it. Also, I'm with you on the smooth thing. If they don't like smooth liquor, go by the mass produced crap. LOL
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Are we talking about adding the glucose AFTER distillation to add character, or would we be using the glucose from the start of fermentation? I'm thinking that using a more pure sugar from the git-go should result in a more pure product in the end. I see that we are adding it to the end product, but has anyone ran off a batch started with glucose to compare it? Maybe I'll give that a run this summer to see. How much was that glucose for say 25 lbs.?
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Add the glucose AFTER you do your cutting and filtration. When you add your essence, add a couple of ounces of glucose to each 750ml you make to give it 'presence'. I think you'll love it once you try it. The extra sweetness is practically imperceptible but it will give it a much better texture. I use it all the time.
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Do any of you use corn sugar to start your batches instead of cain sugar? If so what difference do you find?
So what happened to your 1500W coil? Mine works perfect everytime and I can't even imagine ever going back to propane. It's mounted inside the keg and I have a Lutron slider swich which is also rated at 1500W. Once you reach temp and set it you never have to fool with it again for the rest of the run. There are no tanks to fill, no fumes to deal with, no noise, and I don't have to worry about a flame run. I also pull my coil out and clean it between each run. But I would really like to know what happened to yours so I can watch for it.
I go to tails after I get below 93% until it stops. I'm sure it's drinkable, but I just save it for the next batch.
I have only used Prestige myself. The Ouzo was excellent as was the Jamacian Rum, but the burbon left a lot to be desired. My buddy's ,who is also my mentor, stuff who swears by Top Shelf is universally excellent. But there could be a factor in there that everything he makes that I've tasted, beer, wine, grappa, brandy, and hooch have all been excellent.
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I use regular cane sugar in my mash and have never tried the corn sugar.
I had a 1500 watt Broil King plate burner that just stopped working and I never discovered why. I dropped a little over $140 invested in that setup for it to only work twice. I was, to say the least, a little upset over that. I would love to be able to go back to electric but there is no way that I'm aware of that would allow me to mount one inside the Brewhaus still.
I'm curious as to how you can test your strength while making a run. I have to wait until it's finished, then cool it to 68 deg. F before using the alcoholometer to verify its purity.
I am not going to knock Top Shelf but I do have a problem with its cost and the fact that they advertise their essences to flavor 1.125 ltr. I may be talking through my hat but of the ones I've tried, all but one only flavored 750 ml. instead of the advertised 1.125 ltr..
Considering the quality of the Prestige product, the lower cost and the excellent customer service I get from Brewhaus, I doubt I'll ever change.
I'm glad your friend and mentor is so successful in his endeavors and enjoys his brand of essence. Taste being as subjective as it is, I dare say we could get as many opinions as there were tasters on every essence tried. LOL
Any suggestions as to how I might convert back to electric without incurring too much expense would be appreciated.
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I have heard others complain about plate burners. And I certainly would understand your chagrin about popping $140 and it only working twice! I use a beer keg for my kettle. The Brewhaus ones are really nice but too expensive for me and the columns fit perfectly on a keg. For a small batch ,26L,I use a 1/4 keg ,pony keg, and a regular 15.5 gal keg for larger batches. Into the keg I had a hole drilled and a bushing welded in. Then I bought a regular $8 hot water heater coil from Home Depot and screwed it in. The dimmer switch I picked up on Ebay for $25. The larger keg I use two coils. The top coil I unplug as soon as I am up to temp and regulate only the bottom coil. You don't really need but one coil in the larger keg, but having a second one helps speed up the initial heat up. With the cost of the brewhaus kettle, I don't think I would be drilling holes and welding into it unless you got instructions from Rick.
I use Erlenmeyer flasks to collect my distillants as I go and they can easily be placed on ice or in the fridge for quick cool down. You can also use a chart to determine temp to % ratio. I use an ice bath water recycling system for cooling so it's easy to cool enough to test.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not upselling Top Shelf, it really is expensive! Mostly I just drink my stuff as it is. Have you tried a Tequilla Sunrise made with hooch instead of Tequilla? It's awsome. It also makes great Margaritas, Pina Colodas, and Martini's. Not to mention all the Vodka combos. So I really have little use for essence on the whole.
Good luck with your endevors. This is a great hobby! Let me know how yours turns out when you leave it in the fermentor longer.
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Capt said Broil King plate burner that just stopped working and I never discovered why.
Inside the workings of almost all hot plates is a thermal resistor that opens the circuit when the temperature is exceeded. They are there to keep the wiring from baking to a crisp. It appears that he prolonged use of the hot plate can create an environment that gets rather warm. After I replaced mine several times I hit on raising the hot plate about a half inch to allow for more air to circulate under the whole unit. The thermo resistor is going to look just like a resistor and should be inline with one of the leads, very possibly incased in a thermal shield of some type. You can cut it out and wire directly or replace it and play it safe. Radio shack carries them for about a dollar each.
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You have spurred my interest in electric heating again. LOL I wonder if I could impose upon you to give me the makers and part numbers of the items you use in the heating element and the control. It may be possible for me to alter my kettle to work like yours. That would be so much better than having to get out the propane and work with that.
Is the element covered ,pipe or such, or does it just sit in the liquid? Also, is it mounted up from the bottom or in from the side and would there be any advantage to either way of mounting? How far should it be kept from the sides or bottom?
Lastly, how do you wire the unit to the dimmer switch? Also, how do you keep the dimmer cool? With that much wattage it should get very hot. I know I'm asking a lot from you but I would greatly appreciate your help. Your expertise in this could make my life a lot easier. LOL
I'll have to try some of my 'Sweet Water' in a Tequila Sunrise the next time and the other drinks you mentioned. I appreciate your help and input. Take care!
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Thanks for the info Pete but unfortunately it's a little too late. I 'chunked' as we say down south the whole thing in the trash.
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Sure I'd be happy to share with you my eletric systems. First I bought three 1500W 120V hot waters heater coils from Home Depot for $8 each.  then I took my keg to a welder who ordered the bushings from McJumkin Corp for another $8 each , http://www.mcjunkin.com/, Once the bushing is welded in you just simply screw the coil in and out at your pleasure.  I use 14 gauge wire for everything. Next I bought a Lutron NOVA N-1500 WH 1500W dimmer switch off Ebay for $25 + shipping from , http://www.atotlampslightbulbstore.biz/servlet/StoreFront, which has it's own heat sink so there really isn't any heat issue with the switch or wire. Then I wired it to a recepticle so I could plug in any of the three coils to it.   Here is a pic of my larger boiler as well  You can see I placed one of the coils close to the bottom and the other about mid way. The mid way coil is used only to bring the initial temp up quickly and is plugged directly into the wall, not the switch. It is unplugged once the temp is up and the rest of the run is controlled my the switch.  The other recepticle and switch in the photo controls the cold water pump system for my cooling. The kegs cost $12 each so total investment in the TWO boilers with eletronics comes to under $100 plus whatever your welder charges you.
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Nice setup, I had considered something similar. Never thought about the three coil system. Great job!
Once again never underestimate homebrewers! We always modify original equipment to meet our needs.
Ati2ude
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What a GREAT setup Elricko! I'm going to see if I can copy it for myself. Thanks for going to all the trouble of photographing and explaining your design. I think I'll modify the Brewhaus keg with just one heating coil since it's the 6.5 gal. kettle. Again, thanks for sharing.
Regards,
Tom
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